Last month, RetcH dropped his first album in four years since 2022’s Administrative Segregation. During the hiatus, the New Jersey rapper was both dealing with lingering legal issues, while also enjoying the fruits of his labor.
“When I really think about that time, what I was doing was just running around enjoying life. I was having a good time,” he tells me during our hour-long convo at Billboard’s New York City office. “I had just got off house arrest after I got sentenced to three years for a probation violation, which stemmed from catching a gun charge in California. I also still had an open case at the time, which ended up coming back around later on.”
He’s now ready to get back to work and has a new perspective on things, especially music. “All types of different things factored into my shift in perspective,” he told me during our interview. “It could be often that I run into artists or people that take being in this business for granted. You gotta think about what got us here, you know what I’m saying? For the most part, it’s the love of music. So, the fact that any of us are even able to make a living off of this thing right here is a beautiful thing. It’s a blessing for everybody: me, you, and anybody else that works in this building. It’s a craft.”
At 19, RetcH came out the gate with an album that many rap fans consider a classic in Polo Sporting Goods, with fellow Jersey native (by way of Chicago) producer Thelonious Martin. That tape put RetcHy Lo Sweater on the map and raised expectations, which I would say he met with the release of the much more sinister Finesse the World a couple years later in 2015. Now, with FTW 2, he decided to go back to the darker tone that made 2015’s Finesse the World a fan favorite.
Talking to Billboard, he explains more about why he decided to go this route, his plans to be more consistent and purposeful with his music, and his new video for “Point Guard,” which we’re premiering today. Check out our conversation below.
All right, so let’s talk about this “Point Guard” video.
“Point Guard” is one of my favorite songs of the project, and I feel like the video really captures the song. We were in Harlem in the projects and on a basketball court. There’s a lot of point guard and basketball references in the song, like when I say, “Keep a shooter on the wing like Crittenton.” He was the teammate that got caught with Gilbert Arenas in the lockerroom when they were on the Wizards.
Yeah, Javaris Crittenton. He really did time after that too.
He allegedly shot at some people or something like that. I think a girl got hit, if I’m not mistaken, and she died. He got sentenced like 20 years for that s—t. [ed. note: Crittenton pled guilty to manslaughter and was sentenced to 23 years in prison.] He only did like 10 off that motherf—ker, though. He home now. He on podcast and s—t.
You gotta have some hoop knowledge to know what’s going on. I also say, “Like Agent Zero,s we brought Glocks out.” Brought the poles to the arena like Agent Zero/ We brought the Glocks out/ N—as in the paint gettin’ boxed out should I say boxed in.” N—as could put two and two together. It’s all basketball references. That’s what make the song hard. “I got shooters on the bricks/ I got shooters in the joint ’cause they really up the score.” I’m just making correlations between hoops and the streets, you feel me?
How’s your writing process? Do you write in a notebook or in your phone? Do you kinda freestyle and punch in?
I do both. It really depends on how I’m feeling in the moment. I travel a lot, so I do a lot of writing while I’m traveling. I listen to beats and I write. I got a lot of producers on my team that I f—k with. I got my man B-Wolf, I got my man G LOK, I got my son Zooter McGavin, I got my boy Axel, P on the Boards, obviously. V Don.
G LOK has a couple beats on FTW 2.
Yeah, G LOK did “Point Guard.” That’s like one of my main producers right there.
So, are you using the Notes app when you’re traveling?
Yeah, I write in the Notes app. If I gotta put pen to paper and s—t, I will. I’m not opposed to it, but I usually got the phone nearby, so I’ll cook up on the phone. What I say is intentional. I can go in the studio and freestyle, and I can still make an intentional song that way too.
I figured you probably write for the most part because of the way your rap style is.
There’s a lot of thought that goes into it, I’m not even gonna sit and act like it’s not. I like that people could recognize that and be able to tell that somebody is really sitting there crafting this s—t and not something that’s put together quick. I can do that too, but I also take pride in being able to actually sit down and listen to a beat, and just pull s—t from the sky.
Who shot the video?
My man Blake, 39 Enterprises. He shot the video. That’s like one of my main guys that I work with, and my man Zai Visuals. He’s the one that edited the video. I got a cool little collaborative team that I work with. They both play both roles, they shoot and edit videos. Sometimes Zai will edit Blake s—t, and Blake will edit Zai’s s—t, and we’ll mix and match the footage. Both were doing work with me separately and I brought them together because we were all working towards the same thing. I consider them as part of my team. They’re there for the day-to-day stuff, not just for music videos.
We’ve had this conversation before, right? I think you were kinda making trap music in a sense. Your flow was faster and with this you’re going back to that darker, Finesse the World style. Why did you decide to do that?
It was time. Sometimes it’s just the right time. the right time for things. That’s why the opening bars of the entire project is me saying, “N—as selling drugs, this the soundtrack/ Why these n—as acting like I couldn’t bring the sound back.” It never left. I always was making that music, but I remember what was happening at that time. This music wasn’t that celebrated when I was putting it out. I remember that. Y’all don’t remember that because y’all going off the nostalgic factor, and I understand that because that’s what fans do. I’m a fan of music too.
Nostalgia is always gonna hit. But I do remember the actual time of putting out Polo Sporting Goods and putting out Finesse the World, and it was celebrated by my community, and people did praise it and s—t like that. How they bigging it up today? They wasn’t doing all that. The energy didn’t feel that way at the time. There’s something that a great producer friend of mine said to me years ago. He said, “Hip-hop is like a revolving door, but there’s always new s—t that’s gonna come out. There’s always gonna be new styles, new fads, new sounds, but it always circles back to this.”
To the real s—t?
Exactly. He said it always circles back to this. Right now, it’s like… I don’t want to give the gameplan up too much, but it’s a lane that’s not being touched. It’s not too many people running in this lane. It felt like it was ahead of its time. Somebody just told me that listening to it don’t sound no different. You could run Finesse the World and FTW 2 right into the other. Like a double-disc [project]. Same energy. A lot of times, when you get sequels, they don’t really give you that vibe. Movies, projects, anything.
I feel like you left it a little too early — and you feel the same way, because we wouldn’t be having a conversation otherwise.
Like I said, I don’t feel like it was as celebrated as it is right now, on both ends. The business end and the public. At the end of the day, we doing business, right? We gotta make this s—t make sense.
You said “a lot of muthaf—kas can’t capture that energy.”
Yeah, that sound. When I hit producers, they know what I want. Send me that evil s—t, that dark s—t. That’s the tone. That’s what I’m asking for. What makes you gravitate towards that that type of sound. Life. That’s how s—t happens for me, you feel me? I’m telling my story. I can’t tell nobody else’s story other than my own.
What did you grow up listening to, though? Because then, you could kinda hear some early Scarface and Three 6 Mafia influence.
I did grow up listening to a lot of Koopsta Knicca. He was part of early Three 6 Mafia. That’s interesting. Devil’s Playground, that was my s—t. A lot of Eminem. Slim Shady LP, Marshall Mathers LP, heavy Stack Bundles, Hov, Reasonable Doubt.
I listen to that all the time, after I went to see him perform it live, I feel like it doesn’t get enough credit for how atmospheric it sounds. He created a world, or like brought the listener into his.
And that’s probably why I do what I do. I like to create a world. When I think about making a project, I think about creating a world that you can step into. You gotta be in the mood to listen to FTW 2. It’s not casual music. It’s energy. When I put on [Mobb Deep’s] Infamous, I’m stepping into a world. When that first knock goes off on “Eye for an Eye,” it’s like you stepping into the projects, it’s like you’re walking out of a project elevator and into the f—kin’ courtyard.
Can fans expect you to go back to this style for a little? You gonna stay in this zone for for the next couple projects?
I mean, I like this pocket. I always loved this pocket. I was never afraid of this pocket, you know what I’m saying? We have Finesse the World, we got Polo Sporting Goods, we got After the Verdict, so it’s always been a thing that we’ve done. Right now, I love that it’s being celebrated to the degree that it is. I’ma stick around and see how it unfolds. We’re definitely having a good time in this pocket because, like you said, it has a darker undertone and it’s not really identical to anything else that’s really out. And that’s just me being myself. I’m not outwardly trying to do that, that’s just how it comes across. I’m heavy on artistic integrity, on being yourself. I don’t make it for the purpose of any type of particular praise from any particular community.
Were you planning on making a sequel to Finesse the World, or did it end up being that way based on the tone the music were making?
Yeah, [the latter] for sure. Once I got like six, seven songs in, the general consensus was that the music was sounding like Finesse the World. So once that idea got sparked, then the direction was set.
On “HOW ITS GOING (1/2 OF IT),” you allude to the hiatus you took. Can you talk about why you decided to take a four-year break?
I had a little legal situation that happened one of those years, like a little eight-month hiatus, but for the rest of that time, there were a combination of things. Dealing with regular life s—t. None of us can avoid the regular human aspect of this s—t. That exceeds music and being an artist and being whoever people think I am to them. I got my own s—t, my own people, my own life, and all the other things that’s important to me outside of this, so I spend a lot of time dealing with that. I was also enjoying the fruits of my labor.
You were finally able to have fun with that “Lemon” money that you got from Pharrell?
[Laughs.] I probably had been ran through that s—t at that point. Shout out Pharrell and Rihanna. It was a couple bands. It was some dollars.
You were kind of making up for lost time, because you had got locked up.
I think subconsciously, yes. That’s not what I said I was doing. But subconsciously? Probably. Word, because you said you got off house arrest, so you wanted to enjoy your freedom, I guess you know? I was in Hawaii. I was in Miami. I was in New York. I was in Cali. I was all these places Were you making music during this time? I was making music. I just wasn’t really I wasn’t putting music out. I got that whole time documented.
Shout out my boy Zai Visuals again, he was running around with me that whole time. He was with us down Miami on the yacht with the h–s. I was in Hawaii on vacation with my little vibe and I got Zai a room down the hallway. F—k it, we all on vacation. Life is a flip. As artists, how we live outside of being in the studio and the music that we’re putting out is also interesting to people. So, I did make the effort to document that time. I ain’t put it all out yet, but I do got it. So, that time gap right there? I do have a lot of what we was doing.
When were you recording Finesse the World 2? Are some of those songs from that time period?
That’s all recent. I got all the music from that time period.
You said that you decided to go with Finesse the World 2 after you made a couple songs, but did you start recording with a new project in mind?
I just started recording. I was in L.A. with my boy G LOK and he was playing me a bunch of s—t that he had, and he’s been leaning towards trying to make s—t in that pocket and get back to that sound. So, we were together a lot and he’s somebody who I really hold near and dear to my heart, dear to this s—t. I appreciate and respect bro opinion on musical s—t, so he’s really heavy on the fine art aspect of what we do here and holding it in that type of regard.
Not that he opened my eyes to seeing a bigger picture of what we’re doing here, and what this means to the culture, but he did aid in that. He helped push back into that direction. He was just saying that this s—t was like fine art. He was just stressing the importance of what this means on a bigger scale. We believe in cultural impact. So, for Finesse the World and Polo Sporting Goods, and all those projects to be held in such high regard, I wanted to do something to honor that and to pay tribute to that. At this day and age, and at this stage? That’s fine art at its finest.
That’s the artistic integrity part and the cultural impact part that I speak on as far as being able to put together something that can bring you back to that space after 11 years. I feel like that’s kind of special, and I’m not saying that being biased because it’s me. I would say that for any artist just me being a fan of the art. I think that’s special to be able to captivate a sound, and encapsulate a time by bringing people back to a time through sonics.
I feel like the projects that people f—k with the most out of your catalog are Polo Sporting Goods, Finesse the World, Lean & Neck, and After the Verdict, right?
Yeah, they love those projects. Those projects are held in different regard from the other ones.
It’s not like you put out garbage in between those projects — and I get where you were trying to go with some of that stuff, and I go back to a couple songs on stuff like Still Up and Gone Til’ Autumn, but I always preferred this type of rap from you. I say that to say that I remember you would sometimes get upset when people would bring up making another Polo Sporting Goods or whatever. Maybe “upset” is the wrong word, but essentially it’s basically people trying to tell you what to do with your art.
I wasn’t really getting upset. I think that was mistaken. I was defensive about the art that I felt was being disregarded or overlooked. You comparing me to me, which is okay. I’m saying those projects still exist, and they’re disregarding them. I liked that music. But I understood what happened. Polo Sporting Goods was the thing that kind of brought me into a bigger limelight. That’s what they identify me with.
I don’t want to speak for you, but was it tough putting out something that’s considered a classic out the gate?
They gotta understand the timeline. I dropped that when I was 19 years old. I had just got out of high school when I dropped that project. I had dropped two previous projects when I was in school. I had like local buzz already. When I graduated high school, I was already in the mix around artists and s—t, which kinda grew gradually. So, what I was doing as a hobby started catching like real traction in the world. I was just chillin’, makin’ music, vibin’, and just started catch traction.
Then I started being around real artists who were actually making a living off this s—t, and it kinda spiraled into that. The projects I put out prior to Polo Sporting Goods sounded like the music on Richer Than the Opps, Still Up, all that type of stuff. So, the people who really know, they know that wasn’t me doing something different. That was me doing what I always was doing. Polo Sporting Goods was something different. That’s what n—as didn’t realize.
See, now what happened at that time — if motherf—kas really want to know and make it make sense — what makes Polo Sporting Goods something different was because this is when I started hanging out with Action Bronson and Alchemist and Roc Marci and Harry Fraud and Meyhem Lauren and Smoke DZA.
That makes sense, because you could tell by some of the rhymes and the subject matter.
Action was on the album and I did have a song with Meyhem Lauren and Smoke DZA hat I didn’t end up putting on there. I don’t know why I didn’t use that song, but those my n—as. But yeah, at that time I was around that group of individuals, and that was the music that we was making within our our friend group. We was just on that sound. I got hooked up with Thelonious through my man Suli from Chicago. I was in tune with Suli in L.A., we knew a lot of the same people. Then me and Thelonious started cooking up. We had a couple joints and it started sounding like something was coming together and ended up making history.
You came out the gate with something that people consider a classic. Have you ever felt any pressure trying to recreate that? “If you want Polo Sporting Goods, then listen to it”?
I always knew that I had the power to do that. Your sound got darker after that when you dropped Finesse the World as the follow-up. Oh, s—t, man. If anybody’s ever been 19 and then never grew up.
[Laughs.] You want to evolve too, right? And make different music.
If you listen to my music, it’s all lifestyle music. Life evolved. So, as life evolved, the music evolved. A lot of things that happened changed me as a person. Legal issues, people passing away prematurely through gun violence or whatever other. Unfortunate circumstances. You name it. Losing friends. The growing pains of life growing up in the hood. Those things change you in different ways.
Some people go through certain adversities and they could become bitter or broken. And some people use that s—t as fuel and energy, as fire to push and persevere to get to where they want to go to. I chose the latter. We all gonna go through s—t. Nobody can avoid that aspect of life. You’re gonna face some sort of adversity somewhere.
And that’s reflected in the music.
Exactly. That’s why I make what I make because somebody out there gonna relate. Your tribe gonna find you. I don’t put too much emphasis on public opinion and what the people say, but I do like to see what the people are saying because public dialog is one of the best sources of original information that you’ll get nowadays with AI and all these different things. This is why social media platforms stress original content creators because with all this new digital s—t and all this AI s—t, that’s the one thing that AI can’t replicate. AI can’t make original, funny, brand new content.
A video of you just f—king around got you on a Pharrell and Rihanna song.
Being myself on social media. That had nothing to do with music, and it still came back to some music s—t. I got musical accolades for it when I didn’t really do anything musical on my part.
Having some personality can go a long way for artists in general, just not rappers. You can make great music if they don’t have a personality. So, is it safe to say that you’re gonna be more consistent? Would you consider this the start of a new era?
This is what I’m here for. This is my contribution to history. I didn’t see it from that perspective before. I have a totally new perspective on this whole thing. Like I said, life changes you. How you was thinking at 18 wasn’t the how you was thinking when you got to 25.
What’s the feedback been like for FTW 2?
They f—king with it, man. The streets going crazy, man. I don’t know if you seen it. We got street billboards. Shout out to Anna City, man. One of the lit graffiti artists in the city and s—t. She did a fire little piece for n—as on Delancey and Attorney St. right there in the Lower East Side.
What’s next now after this?
We got a bunch of videos still to come. We still gonna keep rolling this out. Yeah, we gonna keep rolling this s—t out. After public feedback, we’re going to make videos for some of their favorite songs. We got “DAYSHIFT/NIGHTSHIFT” with $ha Hef & V Don, “HOOD NEWS,” P on the Boards produced that one.
Yeah, I like that one too.
The bros love that one right there. “HOW ITS GOING (1/2 OF IT).”
So, you’re probably gonna do a video for every song, essentially.
S—t, the way things are looking. I feel like I gotta do something for at least two of those three.
So, are you gonna be more active on social media when it comes to posting videos and tweeting like you used to?
Community is very important in this business, man. The people that you got around you is very important. They give me a lot of good advice and they they steer me in a good direction with a lot of s—t. Part of that is playing off the the strengths. I stopped being stingy with myself. I’ve been posting more., being a little bit more social. It’s not that I hate to do that s—t, I just don’t care to. It feels like a job after a while. You know what I’m saying? But, also to, it doesn’t hurt me and it be funny. I be laughing. We love humor. We love a good joke. It is cool to share that aspect of your personality with the people.